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Jeff ( & Marty ) Hugneys car at Toms house
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Victory Lane
Picture of Tom McGinnity
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I removed the headlamp etc from the right side and unplugged the motor.. same result. I plugged it back in and unplugged the left side motor... same result. I unplugged both motors.. same result..

So: I checked the ground off the first relay to the core support.. looks great.

Mike or whomever... are you thinking like I am that there is a dead hot short somewhere?

I remember when I was doing under dash stuff when I plugged in the diode I heard both motors running continuously.. I paid it no nevermind as thats not what I was caring about at the time.. so I'll say both motors are good.. so it would seem that the unerdash is tip top and both motors work,,, Hmmmmmmmm confused


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)
 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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Side note: I just swapped out a known good relay for all three relays with no change.. I also crossed over the circuit breaker posts with a screw driver real quick to see if the breaker was super weak.. absolutely not! that baby heated up cherry red in 1 second.. I think maybe I need to pull the headlamp pods and check all the wiring bundles? confused

The fact that one door moves quickly before the circuit breaks tells me the under dash area is good? agreed?


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)
 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Victory Lane
Picture of MLakin
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Geez Tom, first you get crazy backwards motors and now,,,

Well the whole "control" part of the wiring which is all of the under dash stuff is isolated from the breaker output, so even if it were a problem it couldn't trip the breaker.

Wondering about this. Ignition/headlights off, if you manually open the doors what happens if you hit the ignition? If they do or don't do the same thing might help pinpoint the issue. From what you've tried unless something is plugged in in the wrong spot (limit switches?) it would almost have to be a short somewhere. Headlights on, Relay 1 energizes connecting orange cir breaker wire to dark blue limit switch to motor wires. Might try unplugging all dark blue wires (with the doors closed) and if it doesn't trip plug em in one by one.

Here is a troubleshooting guide that spells out limit switch hook-ups and such:
http://www.retro-electro.net/FAQ67.html

This message has been edited. Last edited by: MLakin,


Mike L.
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Indy | Registered: 20 September 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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Let us know what happens when you try what Mike suggested. I'm thinking either one of your motors is faulty or the nut that tightens the motor to the swing arm for the door is too tight. These are very finicky. If motors are good (from testing one unplugged, then the other) try loosening the nuts on the motors and testing again.
 
Posts: 1598 | Location: Canada | Registered: 13 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Victory Lane
Picture of MLakin
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David if I read it right the breaker still tripped with BOTH motors unhooked. Something is drawing boo-coo current and it isn't the motors.


Mike L.
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Indy | Registered: 20 September 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
Picture of PeterPar
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Not knowing how the limit swithes on the headlight assy are physically wire, if the open and closed contacts of the limit switch on the headlight assy were wired in the reversed, I could see how the motors ran after replacing the diode. If I'm reading the schematic correctly, this same situation would also be a direct short when the light switch was turned on. Check continuity between the ground wire at the limit and the wire going to the motor with the headlights in the closed position. You should have it. If you don't, check for continuity between the wire going to motor and the brown wire. If you have it there, the contacts are reversed. Hope I don't confuse you more, but I would check this first.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: PeterPar,
 
Posts: 1017 | Registered: 27 May 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
Picture of Tom McGinnity
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Thanks. David.. the motors are original style and the nut was loose as a goose. I tightened the nut just the right amount to allow slippage as designed and it all works well and you can move the doors with your hand with some resistance.

Pete. I started diagnosingwitches and the very first one did this ( its a new repro ). I have the battery undone and the key is off and the light switch is on.. this way all I have to do is reach over and connect the battery as I am alone..

Ok. touch the battery on and the breaker breaks.. Unplug the double blue wire and nothing shorts out.. touch the blue to the switch and it blows.. so I replace with an NOS unit I have.. i open the door by hand and plug in the switch.. the door opens and I press the button and it stops.. wow.. seem like a bad switch right? well.. IF you touch the little black ground wire to ground....it sparks and blows the breaker.. yes the ground strap sparks off the core support..blows the breaker and smokes a bit from the full voltage! I looked at all the wires going to all the switches (4). Following my chart from American Autowire as un-f-ing believable as this sounds.............................. The fellow that assembled this system managed to install every switch upside down but with the wires in the correct position... basically as wrong as you can be

So now I'm not popping the breaker as much but am at times... I chase everything with the test light.. find the pass side motor is dead.. I disassembles the whole thing and removed it from the car.. I tested the motor on the bench... DED dead.. I had an NOS.. UGH.. now I'm using up all my hidden gold getting this baby running Roll Eyes

Ok heres where we are right now I think...

both doors work but one is closing while the other is opening ??????? confused The drivers seems to be bahaving properly but the pass side is going in the oppsoite intended direction and to add insult to injury the motor will not stop reunning regardless of the switches...

Think I should change BOTH pass side switches now? I'm running out of stuff to change roll


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)
 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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The troubleshoot chart I have doesn't mention this dilemma


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)


 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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Anybody got a good fair guess for an NOS motor? I've had it so long I don't know what I paid?


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)


 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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These charts are bery helpful BTW


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)


 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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Tom, take a DVM and find the common wire to both sets of contacts of a limit swith. This should be the wire going to the motor. Then check which contact is in the closed position when the door is closed. This should be going to ground. The other contact of the limit should be open and the wire connected to it should be brown. It sounds like the wires could have been crossed when they were put into the connectors. I would check all the limit switches to make sure the commons and the open and closed contacts are wired correctly. If a brown or a blue wire was in the common socket of a connector, it short when the contact to ground closed.
 
Posts: 1017 | Registered: 27 May 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
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Hey, I have another question. When you installed the diode, how was the connection made? If the diode was installed backwards, it would not let current flow through it to energize relays R2 and R3. These two relays are switching the polarity for the motor to open and close.
 
Posts: 1017 | Registered: 27 May 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Victory Lane
Picture of Tom McGinnity
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Pete! I'm 14 hours deep into this car since Friday nite and have a Superbowl thing to do now so I'm done hammer

I will definitely check that the switches are functioning correctly and in synch with each other.. I was pretty confident with the diode and with both doors at least moving now and not throwing breakers I'm pretty confident its the switches or like you said.. maybe the guy that assembled the wiring harness plugged a wire into one of the many slots incorrectly..

The comedy of it all is how much was truely wrong, broken, missing, upside down etc.. You would have to go out of your way to make a system this screwed up.. almost like an SAE mechanics test... except this bitch is the final exam Mad Cheers

and I'm no electrician Confused

thanks for the continued help


tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c)
 
Posts: 13401 | Location: Arlington Mass | Registered: 01 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
<GaryB>
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Tom, there is a pair of NOS ones on EPay right now. I was bidding, but they are at $400 and the auction is not over yet.
 
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Victory Lane
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And the pair on Ebay seem to be for the same side (not left and right side).
 
Posts: 1598 | Location: Canada | Registered: 13 May 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Camaro Pace Cars .Com    My Forum Home Page    All Years Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  1967 Pace Car  Hop To Forums  1967 Tech. & Restoration    Jeff ( & Marty ) Hugneys car at Toms house