David, you are right, but the motors are the same. Just the wire colors are different, as far as I know anyways. I could be wrong.

Tom, the headlight doors look like they swing in the opposite direction from the other side. Toward the center. Can both motors run clockwise and still open each door? If not, the motor rotation on the passenger door running the same direction as the driver side could cause the door to try to close and not shut off. If this is the case, then the limits may be wired correctly and the two wires in the leads from the motor may need to be swap in their connector half. You might try using two jumpers between the connectors to reverse them to check. This should change the motor rotation.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: PeterPar,

Pete.. I'll try that when I get home from work!

quote:

Originally posted by Tom McGinnity:

...and I'm no electrician ...

Sorry I cant help either, but I know by the end, you will be a master electician and able to write a pissa troubleshooting guide for the 67 RS owners.

These motors are like power window motors and can turn either way depending on current flow. Hook the wires to it one way and it turns clockwise, reverse the wires and you get counter clockwise. IMHO

Gary, I think we're on the same page. I believe the problem with the driver door opening and passenger door trying to close is because both motors are running the same direction when they should opposite of each other.

You said the motors are the same except for the color of the motor leads. Tom's picture shows the motor he took out has a green and white lead. The motor he replaced it with has a brown(or maybe red) and white wire. I think this is the factory indentifying that the driver door had a clockwise rotation and the passenger door had counter clockwise rotation. Don't a boats running lights use a green for port (right) and a red for starboard (left).

The problem of troubleshooting a system like this is you have to be aware of the mechanical operation as well as the electrical function. You need to verify that both the electrical connections and the mechanical operation of those devices are as the drawing shows. A prime example of this is the limit switch Tom found installed incorrectly. It could have been wired as shown, but because it was not installed properly, it did a function that it was not designed to do on the drawing. The motors are another example. The door motors are shown on the drawing, but it makes no mention of the rotation other than the travel path of the doors. I think you'll find the mechanics of the equipment required the driver door to have the opposite rotation than the passenger door. The only way to know this for sure is to check the passenger side assy operation.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: PeterPar,

Too much family stuff last night.. I will check a few things tonight.. swapping the motor polarity or what have you will be the first order of business. second: I bought a continuity tester not just a test light so I can work better.. I will check the switches etc with that.

Looking forward to it becuase I don't want to do this anymore

Well I had wondered about the switches and wondered if they could be installed backwards or not. Guess the answer is yes.
They are SPDT pushbuttons (Single Pole, Double Throw [single switch with the common connections going to the motor and two other connections]). Being a SPDT pushbutton then they have a Common connection, a NO (Normally Open) and a NC (Normally Closed). So when they were installed backwards had a NC where there should have been a NO. My guess, as soon as the working door lifted off the switch the incorrect contact shorted the circuit tripping the breaker.

One note though, I did find one troubleshooting guide that cautioned not to try to run the motor(s) without both limit switches connected correctly as it could cause to motor to run the opposite direction. Not sure looking at the schematic how this could occur though. Just throwing it out there just in case.

http://www.pozziracing.com/67_rs_headlight_doors.htm

"Don't try turning on the headlights with just one limit switch hooked up to test. The motor will run opposite and could cause damage if allowed to run. The system only works when all wires are attached to appropriate switches."

If you didn't see it, at the bottom of the first link I gave on page 2 has a helpful guide:

How are the limit switches wired?
There are four limit switches on the 67 RS. The limit switch terminals should be wired as follows:

All limit switch ground terminals should face down.

Limit switch located on driver's side of the radiator support:
Plug with single purple wire attaches to the top terminal of the switch.
Plug with two blue wires attaches to bottom terminal of the switch.

Limit switch located on driver's side headlight capsule:
Plug with single white wire attaches to the top terminal of the switch.
Plug with two brown wires attaches to bottom terminal of the switch.

Limit switch located on the passenger's side of the radiator support:
Plug with single bright green wire attaches to the top terminal of the switch.
Plug with single blue wire attaches to bottom terminal of the switch.

Limit switch located on passenger's side headlight capsule:
Plug with single green wire attaches to the top terminal of the switch.
Plug with single brown wires attaches to bottom terminal of the switch.

ONE MORE NOTE: If the both motors have the same color wires then of course you can't follow that exactly, but they would need to be swapped/inverted on one of the motors so it turns the proper direction.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: MLakin,

Clarification on the motors, both sides are the same. There is only one part number listed for replacement. There is not a right and left part number. The rotation direction is controled by the circuit and associated components (relays, limit switches) under the drivers fender. The motor direction and stopping and starting are dictated by those componentts and how they are connected as noted by Mike and Tom.

The wire color situation may be related to when the motors were built. If I recall, there has only been one motor part number. I don't have material available at the moment to confirm that though. From what I have been able to tell, the early motors use purple and grey leads. I have a bunch of originals and in fact a couple NOS service parts with those leads. The first replacement motors I bought back in the early eighties had a dark green and light green lead. That is probably the most common configuration seen today due to attrition.

Keith C.

As time goes by I think of things:

I need to find the bad NOS motor I had in my C-1 and confirm I did not forget to mark it and install it in this car.. If i did then forget this thread because I'm gonna kill myself

I need to be super certain that the 2 spade plugs for the 3 relay bank are not upside down.. the three spade cannot be obviously.

I will reverse the wires on the motor if anything for curiosity.

I will reinspect the 4 switches for the open and closed natural position

Keith.. because the plug for the motors has the guide they cannot be plugged in wrong.. Iagree that the relays dictate the motor direction and that the motors are the same.. The different color wiring is not important because the plug is guided

To reiterate;
these motors run both directions. Send the current in on the dark green and out on the light green=one direction. Reverse the current flow direction and the motor turns the opposite direction. This is the same way that power window motors operate.

OK... Not sure if this is better or worse

OK here it is: I checked the motor plug first.. no matter what it only went the opposite way of the other.. I made little jumpers and switched the plug... Whamo.. works the correct way and in synch with the drivers side.. very nice and the switches all stop the doors ( four switches work and motors stop when they should )

Now the next issue:

key off, lights off, doors closed, battery undone:

connect battery: nothing happens like expected

turn key switch to simulate starting car...doors open...???

Pull light switch half way out ( parking lamp mode ) doors whirl open... odd. pull light switch all the way on ( to turn headlamps on ) and the doors close again!

with key off headlamp doors won't move

sometimes if you jiggle the headlamp switch the doors will work

The headlamp switch and the diode are new. the entire wiring harness is new and the relays are new.. the switches are new and the breaker is new and works ( I know cuz its tripped 1 billion times this week ) obviously the motors work.. no matter what the breaker doesn't trip anymore so thats nice

what the heck

I'm going to continue checking wire position and will follow Lakins chart in case mines different.. I'm worried that jumping the motor plug 180 is not creating a two wrongs make a right situation as I am not an electrical engineer

I'm hoping I'm close

As sure as I'm typing right now the wiring for the switches is correct.. FYI

I'm now looking to see if the relay wiring isn't flipped in any way.. stay tuned

Thanks Mike for that