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Supporter Victory Lane ![]() |
I just cannot believe there isn't a man out there that knows this stuff.. The few years leading up to 67 were very simular.. The trim tags in 67 on all the full size cars and Chevelles etc are near identical in function.. Chevelle plant worker? Full size car ( whaddid they make in 67 like 1 million of them! )? No guy who can explain dashes and paint? ![]() tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c) | |||
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Supporter Victory Lane ![]() |
Dear 67pacecartrust, yes originaly blue - flipfloptiger tom @ camaropacecars.com ( remove the space between m,@,c) | |||
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2009 Supporter Victory Lane |
Related or not related to this subject, but I wonder if a fleet or commercial color, say like on a gas company car would have carried an 0 code? Should have, does anyone know this for fact? Perhaps this 0-2 coupe came out of some such fleet. Probably more likely some type of retail operation type fleet car. | |||
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Victory Lane![]() |
Mike, I think you nailed it. ![]() Phil@camaropacecars.com | |||
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2009 Supporter Victory Lane |
Actually, does anyone have any proof of any of the decoding of the trim tag to be fact, or is this all educated assumptions from a mass survey? | |||
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Victory Lane![]() |
Tony, I have not "recreated" a thing unless you think Steve is full of it too with the Canadian Mosport info? Critical research there too, and quite important as well-all stemming from The Canadian IPC/AJ Foyt Air conditioning Myth all peddled by the same myth makers who gave us "clear coat over Ermine White" myth. TRUE or NOT?? On to your questions...OK I will bite! Please list your questions here and I will debate you on each and every one of them ![]() I might not get to answer till later, so keep checking back. ![]() Phil@camaropacecars.com | |||
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Victory Lane |
Nice try! And of course I don't agree...but for conversation sake, what exact part are we talking about when it comes to Steve's effort with the MoSport report?
As I've said.... You don't need to swallow the hook line and sinker... I'm not interested in a debate.... You can believe whatever you want to believe! However, if you want to convince some of our fence sitting friends, you can just answer then as you see fit.... they are listed through out! BTW..... With all of the science done on this topic... I'm curious what the camera told you the breakdowns were with the existing C-1 sample cars vs the 0-1 samples from both 03C and 04A samples....I bet everyone would love to see how they compare.... Who knows....I might find myself starting to believe!!! Please tell this was done at least! | |||
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2009 Supporter Victory Lane |
Tony, I think Phil is refering to this. The Canadian car reference is that some of the VVS reports (GM Vintage Vehicle Services from Canada) for the Canadian Festival cars state ermine as the color of paint. For instance, this is the case on 238642. The GM report shows "1001AA-Special Order Ermine white" as the color of paint. | |||
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2009 Supporter Victory Lane |
Here is a photo of the VVS report sheet for 237512. Both of these cars are big block cars built a day apart, and shipped to Canada the same day. Another interesting peculiarity is look at where the cars were shipped, it lists 2 different cities. | |||
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Victory Lane![]() |
No it was not and I will tell you why: C-1 and what it means-is not in debate or in question. I already mixed the exact 1967 paint formulation for Ermine White to confirm that that Ermine White was the actual color on the "0-1" coded IPC Commitment cars. The "color" of the "0" coded cars was the mystery debated here due to the stories we have been told in the books we have all read over the last 16 years. The Color of the C-1 cars has not been and is not in question. There is some info posted right here that you could review. I did reflective research in the one technical post here discussing "spectural and Diffuse reflection". This effect is on display here in this thread for all to see in the photo of Tom's C-1 Pillar and the reflection coming off the surface caused by the flash of the camera. Same effect on the research subject 04-C build commitment car lid (no flash) and the 03-C commitment car lid (flash used), then where Mr. Bevers wipes with the thinner on the same 0-3-C lid (no flash) The same effect can be found in the following two photos that I am going to post here for you. These are 100% unaltered photos of the same paint lids and Paint samples against the same IPC trunk lid used for research. One without the flash, and one with the flash. The reflection coming off the surface tricks our eyes into believing the surface is brighter when it is not. The guy you interviewed believed the cars were brighter, and opined to you that Fleet White was used. The were brighter for several reasons, none of which was related to the selection of a special color. These cars simply reflected light far better than a production paint job. Remember reflectivity and brightness to the eye is a result of three events, the first being the color, the second being the smoothness of the surface, the third being the amount of light present that is reflected back to your eyes. Phil@camaropacecars.com | |||
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Victory Lane![]() |
04-C Commitment build Lacquer Lid (No flash) Phil@camaropacecars.com ![]() | |||
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Victory Lane![]() |
Close up same lid (Flash used) Phil@camaropacecars.com ![]() | |||
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2009 Supporter Victory Lane |
It would be great to see what all 21 of these reports state as the color, but then how do you interpret it? Try and average out how many say "ermine" opposed to only stating 1001AA special paint? No, that doesn't work. I did question the "ermine" white on 238642, and the answer I recieved was the top part of these sheets are/were typed in for each report, and the ermine may have just been typed in by mistake, or just typed in for the sake of putting something there. Not exactly what you want to hear. Notice the format on the top part of the report is different on 238642 which was issued in 2008, compared to the report on 237512, which was issued in 2005. The bottom section that lists the options appears to be some type of database downloaded information, and is the very same point size and style print, while the upper portions of the 2 reports do differ. So now do we believe these reports, or discard the best GM historical documents we have that include the festival cars? | |||
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Victory Lane![]() |
The paint samples mixed from the Infra Red camera scans on top of the same 04-C lid (no flash used). Here are color mixes established by the Camera are on display from one enamel door and two Lacquer lids (all IPC commitment build) against one of the IPC commitment build Lacquer lids. Phil@camaropacecars.com ![]() | |||
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